Jay Shetty interviews Dr. Maya Shankar, cognitive scientist and author of The Other Side of Change, in a live conversation about navigating unexpected life transitions. Shankar, who has worked in the White House and hosts the podcast "A Slight Change of Plans," brings both scientific research and personal experience to understanding how humans cope with unwanted change.

The discussion explores two types of change: the change we choose versus the change that chooses us. Shankar shares her formative experience losing her violin career at age 15 due to injury, which led her to study why some people transform adversity into strength while others struggle. Drawing from years of interviews and cognitive science research, she reveals how change threatens our self-identity and offers practical strategies for building resilience through uncertain times.

Why Identity Anchored to Actions Creates Vulnerability

Shankar's violin injury at 15 revealed how deeply we tie identity to what we do rather than why we do it, making change feel like losing ourselves entirely.

"I felt like Maya and the violin were inextricably attached, and in taking it away from me, I no longer had as much value" - Maya, describing how role loss threatens self-worth.

Society reinforces this by asking children "what do you want to be when you grow up?" instead of "who do you want to be?" or exploring their core passions.

Looking back to childhood playground behavior reveals core motivations - Shankar was drawn to understanding human psychology, foreshadowing her career path.

The Neuroscience of Why Uncertainty Feels Worse Than Pain

Research shows people experience more stress anticipating a 50% chance of electric shock than facing 100% certainty of receiving it.

Internal locus of control (believing we control outcomes) correlates with higher wellbeing, but makes unexpected change more devastating when it shatters that illusion.

The "end of history illusion" tricks us into believing we've finished changing, even though we acknowledge dramatic past transformations.

"We falsely believe that the present is this watershed moment in which we become the person we will be for the rest of our lives" - Maya on cognitive bias.

Self-Affirmation as a Tool for Contextualizing Crisis

During pregnancy loss, Shankar's husband suggested listing five things they were grateful for - initially dismissed as "toxic positivity" but scientifically proven effective.

Self-affirmation exercises involve articulating life values and meaning sources not threatened by current change, reducing tunnel vision and denial.

The practice revealed how single-minded focus on one goal (motherhood) had obscured the richness of her existing life - work, relationships, experiences.

"Did I go to bed overjoyed that night? Of course not. But did I go to bed feeling more whole? Yes, I did" - Maya on the exercise's impact.

Change as Revelation Rather Than Just Destruction

The word "apocalypse" derives from Greek "apocalypsis" meaning revelation - change can unveil hidden truths about ourselves and our beliefs.

Shankar's fertility journey revealed antiquated views about women's value being tied to motherhood, inherited from cultural and family messaging.

"Most of our beliefs were inherited subconsciously from caregivers, and we had so much love wrapped up in that caregiver that to challenge them would have been emotionally dangerous" - Maya.

People interviewed for The Other Side of Change weren't grateful for their hardships but were grateful for who they became through the process.

Building Change Resilience Through Chosen Discomfort

Michael Lewis recommended taking improv comedy classes to practice being off-balance and comfortable with uncertainty.

Chris Hemsworth actively seeks discomfort, arguing that customized comfort in modern life prevents the growth that comes from uncertain situations.

"I feel like that's the only vehicle for growth is to be in these uncertain, uncomfortable situations" - Chris Hemsworth on embracing challenge.

Learning new skills like languages or instruments creates controlled change experiences that build resilience muscles for handling unexpected transitions.