This conversation features Gavin Newsom, Governor of California, and Eric Holder, former U.S. Attorney General and founder of the National Democratic Redistricting Committee. Holder co-founded the NDRC in January 2017 with Barack Obama to combat gerrymandering after analyzing why the Obama administration faced legislative obstacles.

The discussion centers on gerrymandering's impact on American democracy, particularly following the 2013 Shelby County Supreme Court decision that weakened federal voting rights protections. They examine how Republican Project Red Map in 2011 created lasting electoral advantages and how Democrats have responded through state-based strategies promoting redistricting fairness.

A significant focus is California's decision to temporarily abandon its independent redistricting commission in response to Texas's mid-decade gerrymandering, representing a strategic shift for a state that has been the 'gold standard' for fair redistricting. The conversation explores the racial dimensions of gerrymandering and the broader threat to democratic representation across multiple states.

The Origins of Democratic Redistricting Strategy

Holder and Obama formed the National Democratic Redistricting Committee in January 2017 after concluding that gerrymandering prevented Obama from achieving his full agenda despite significant accomplishments.

Republican Project Red Map in 2011 created gerrymandered districts across multiple states that endured through the entire decade, allowing unpopular state-level legislation to pass without political consequences.

The strategy focused on promoting 'fairness' as a weapon: 'People like the idea that citizens ought to choose who their representatives are, as opposed to politicians picking their voters' - Holder.

Shelby County's Devastating Impact on Voting Rights

The 2013 Supreme Court decision removed the Justice Department's ability to pre-clear electoral changes, with Chief Justice Roberts writing that 'America has changed' in his 5-4 majority opinion.

Since Shelby County, states have implemented widespread poll closures, voter purges disproportionately affecting communities of color, and reduced polling locations causing long lines.

The decision didn't remove the Justice Department from the field entirely but 'certainly taken away from the Justice Department a lot of the tools that it once had' - Holder.

NDRC's Success in Promoting Fair Maps

Through state-based strategies, candidate support, legal challenges, and consciousness-raising, the NDRC achieved what analysts and The New York Times called 'the fairest maps in generations' for 2024.

Independent commissions won overwhelming support wherever attempted, including in Missouri and Utah, though Republican legislatures later undermined some citizen-approved measures.

Significant states remain gerrymandered including Texas, Wisconsin, Ohio, Florida, and North Carolina, continuing to be focus areas for NDRC work.

Racial Targeting in Texas Gerrymandering

Texas gerrymandering is 'done on the backs of people of color,' targeting largely Hispanic and African American communities in urban areas like Austin and San Antonio.

Republicans draw 'really weird lines' to dilute electoral power of communities of color while claiming it's 'only partisan' rather than racist - Holder.

The strategy 'always almost always comes down to making it more difficult for people of color to vote and then taking away from people of color, communities of color the political power' - Holder.

Trump's Call and California's Response

Trump called Greg Abbott after reviewing polling numbers showing Republicans 'in real danger of losing our majority in the House of Representatives' without creating more safe Republican seats.

Unlike Georgia Republicans who refused Trump's election interference requests, Abbott 'expressed some concern about it at the beginning, but at the end of the day did exactly what the President asked him to do' - Holder.

California's response meets Holder's three-part test: responsive to Texas actions, responsible in scope, and temporary until after the 2032 census.

California's approach is 'the only maps that are now being presented to the voters themselves' in the most transparent and democratic way - Newsom.

Nationwide Mid-Decade Redistricting Threat

Multiple states beyond Texas are considering mid-decade redistricting including Missouri (already completed), Indiana, Florida, Ohio, and Kansas.

Ohio faces particular scrutiny due to constitutional provisions prohibiting partisan gerrymandering, creating uncertainty about Republican compliance.

Holder characterizes the broader effort as cheating driven by political fear: 'They're afraid of the people who they say they want to represent' and 'fundamentally unAmerican and unpatriotic.'