Gina Raimondo, CFR Distinguished Fellow and former Commerce Secretary under President Biden, previously served as Governor of Rhode Island. She joins hosts Joe Wiesenthal and Tracy Alloway for a live episode recorded at the Council on Foreign Relations on April 1st.

The conversation spans US-Europe relations amid NATO tensions, China's economic strategy against European allies, and the challenges of maintaining technological leadership while managing AI's workforce disruption. Raimondo discusses her experience implementing the Chips Act, export controls on China, and her current work developing transition systems for the AI economy.

Key topics include the fragility of transatlantic partnerships, China's industrial dumping in European markets, the bipartisan survival of semiconductor manufacturing investments, and the urgent need for new policies to prevent mass unemployment during AI adoption while maintaining America's competitive edge.

NATO Tensions and Fraying US-Europe Relations

"I don't think it's that thick" - Raimondo describes the ice between US and Europe as thin, with European patience wearing thin after Trump's expected NATO criticism speech

At Munich Security Conference, European ministers expressed frustration that the US invaded without a strategic plan involving European allies, leading to poor execution despite potentially sound ideas

"We're your closest ally, and it isn't good for you to cozy up to China" - Raimondo's message to Europeans angry about US behavior but making self-destructive choices

China's Economic Assault on European Industry

Chinese imports to Europe surged 20-30% year-to-date versus last year, with China running its standard playbook of subsidizing and dumping cheap products to distort global markets

"The German industrial base is going to get crushed" - China's strategy threatens Europe's chemical and automotive giants through price distortion making competition impossible

The Future of European Competitiveness by Mario Draghi excellently laid out Europe's anemic technology ecosystem problems, including overregulation and weak capital markets that need urgent action

"Supply chain is like the frog's boiled and doesn't know it" - decades of allowing supply chain atrophy led to massive China dependence that requires immediate attention

Winning the AI Race Without Destroying Democracy

"Most Americans when they hear AI, they get afraid" - vast majority associate AI with job loss anxiety, but overregulation would be a mistake for maintaining US leadership

"Automating America's decline" - having the best models, chips, and data centers means nothing with sky-high unemployment and no transition systems

"Putting tens of millions of Americans out of work precipitously will create the end of democracy" - unlike China's industrialize-first approach, democratic societies need different strategies

Small business owners show remarkable optimism about AI productivity gains, while big company CEOs are less convinced about massive workforce reductions due to enterprise implementation timelines

Proposed solution: allow unemployment insurance while starting new businesses, plus subsidies and severance contributions from former employers to facilitate entrepreneurship transitions

Chips Act Success and Remaining Vulnerabilities

"Make sure it's bipartisan" - biggest lesson from Chips Act implementation, which survived political transition because of Republican support unlike partisan Inflation Reduction Act

TSMC now produces leading-edge chips in Arizona "the same way they are in Taipei, Taiwan" with plans to expand under current administration support

US goal to reach 20% of global leading-edge chip capacity by 2030, up from zero percent, but "we still don't really do advanced packaging" - chips return to Taiwan for sophisticated layering

"Thirty percent of printed circuit boards we import from China" plus almost all chemicals and substrates for chip manufacturing, revealing continued supply chain vulnerabilities in AI data centers

Practical Alliances Over Ideological Purity

"We should be working with our allies to shore up all of these supply chains" - Japan's chemical expertise and European industrial base provide beneficial diversification from China dependence

Advocated closer relationships with Indonesia and Philippines for nickel and critical minerals despite labor/environmental standard differences, facing pushback for pragmatic approach

"Is it better to buy everything from China? I don't think so" - balancing values with practical necessity requires working with imperfect partners over Chinese monopolization

"Trade with China is a good thing" for products unrelated to national security - created export promotion initiative for health and beauty products as safe commercial engagement example